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Article:
WTF is 2345: A Look at 5v5 Comps
March 1st, 2008 by Breaky ·
— 2345 Lineup —
Class Comp
Disc Priest / Holy Paladin / Elemental Shaman / Ice Mage / MS Warrior
Strengths
- Great switch ability with intercept from the Warrior and instant MS, along with easy switching for the mage/shaman
- Two offensive purges on targets can “clean up” opposing players very easy, especially when a BoP or BoF appears
- Bloodlust will help either defensivly or offensivly, including a big burst or fast mana burns, or quick CC and fast heals to counter a burst
- Two big burst stoppers with Pain Suppresion and BoP
- A very typical lineup, so mirror matches will occur often, meaning more skill will make the difference…. and some RNG.
Weaknesses
- Has been around for so long, that many know how to counter it well or realise how to play against it… including several lineups designed just to beat it
- Not a whole lot of strong CC, only sheep is really spammable
- Warrior can get caught if pushed up and stuck in beserker often
Overall Summary
This of course has been the most long lasting lineup all through the three seasons, and thus has gotten the name “cookie-cutter” as well, because it has been so popular and works so well. It is a fairly easy composition to run as well, and does give you a good amount of switch options, with plenty of burst potential. Even if the Shaman has already used cooldowns, he can still put out plenty of damage, allowing for multiple burst attempts through out a fight. It of course has potential to still be a top competitor in any BG, but has died off as the dominat composition, that is for sure. Still very fun to play, and worth while if you can get the players for it
— 2346 Lineup —
Class Comp
Disc Priest / Holy Paladin / Elemental Shaman / Felguard Warlock / MS warrior
Strengths
- Strong switch ability on call, Warrior can intercept and MS right away, along with quick CC change from the warlock
- Still has two offensive purges, once again making “cleaning up” targets very easy, and quick removals on BoP and BoF
- Bloodlust allows for a huge burst or a great support defensivley, especially if the opposing team goes for a burst on your warrior or what not
- Same two big burst stoppers with BoP and Pain Suppresion, along with Curse of Tounges from the Warlock to slow opposing casts
Weaknesses
- No decurse for opposing warlocks, so Curse of Tounges/Weakness can hurt your team a lot
- Not as big burst ability as the 2345 lineup, which can hurt burst attempts
- Warlock pet can get banished fairly easy from opposing Warlocks, hurting some CC and assisted damage
Overall Summary
Of course, very similar to the 2345 lineup, with the change of a Warlock instead of a Mage, but it is still a big enough difference to make the playstyle a little bit different. The warlock with less burst ability, still brings that outlast that the mage doesn’t have, with mana drains and lifetap, and very strong CC on opposing players, especially with CoT. This lineup is also usually ran with a Felguard instead of a Felhunter, mainly for assisted damage from the pet, and can be very usefull CC if the intercept is used right. A very growing lineup since the start of season three, it is very fun, and once again can be very dominante in most any BG.
— Euro Comp —
Class Comp
Resto Druid / Disc Priest / Ice Mage / Felguard Warlock / Shadow Step Rogue
Strengths
- Great lock down ability from the Rogue, allowing for control on the focus target
- Huge amounts of CC, ranging from Cyclone, to Fear, to Sheep…. all very effective CC if rotated to refrain from DR.
- Still has decent burst ability from shatter combo of the Mage and constant pressure from the Rogue, along with all the CC thrown around
- Will usually destroy clothie targets if played right
Weaknesses
- Switching is still possible, especially with Shadow Step from the Rogue, but re-applying wound poison takes time, unlike an instant MS cast from a Warrior
- Three clothies on the team, giving an advantage to any multi-physical dps teams
- Coordinating CC can be difficult with so much to throw out, and often will overlap each other if poor-communication occurs
- Only one dispeller for both offensive and defensive from the priest, making dispelling difficult if pressured
Overall Summary
This lineup, from my knowledge, got its name because it was dominant in a recent Europe tournament, thus it didn’t really get big until Season 3… but is and has been very effective since getting knowledge of it. Very good CC from this lineup, along with lockdown from the Rogue on the Focus can make games end fairly quickly if everything goes right. Not a big amount of burst, but not really needed with all the lockdowns from the Druid/Warlock/Mage. It can be more difficult to play however than most other lineups, simply because great CC execution is needed for it to be effective, so communication is very key with this lineup.
— 4 DPS Lineup —
Class Comp
Healer / Cast DPS / Cast DPS / Cast DPS / Rogue
Strengths
- Amazing burst ability of course, if timed correctly on certain targets, can result in death no matter how little CC was put out
- Can force the opposing team to always play defensive, resulting in a huge mana loss for the healers, and eventually a mistake
- No need to target switch for the most part, but if needed, can do fairly easy… even splitting DPS is possible
- Usually very fast games, so you dont have to spend forever in the arena, whether a win or loss
Weaknesses
- Burst stoppers such as BoP and Pain Suppression can really weaken such a team if they are single mind focused
- Not much outlast ability, its either a kill or be killed scenario
- Even if they get one player down, they are still very open to lose a match if not played well, because all CD’s are usually used early
- If not putting enough pressure on the focus target, can be pushed back to the point of no chance at a win
Overall Summary
4 DPS lineups were really non-existent for most of Season 1, but come Season 2, began to be seen on top of a lot of BG’s. Obviously, the class composition is very versatile, with any healer really able to do the job, along with an array of caster DPS to choose from, but a Rogue is needed in most 4 dps lineups to be really successful. Probably the most easiest lineup to play, simply because it just a shit ton of damage on one target, not a whole lot of thinking is needed. Come Season 3 however, more and more teams realized how to counter 4 DPS teams and how to play a lot more defensive early on, making it much more harder for most 4 DPS teams to be successful. It still is a very fun lineup to try though, and is pretty easy especially early on in the bracket, so definitely worth a try if you have not.
— Drain Team —
Class Comp
Disc Priest / Resto Druid / Resto Shaman / MM Hunter / Demon Warlock
Strengths
- Will outlast pretty much every team they encounter if ran correctly, and three healers will result in trouble from any opposing team when attempting to burst
- The priest can play very offensively, because of the support of his other two healers, allowing him to mana burn freely
- Two pets will keep from opposing mana users to drink after there mana has been burned
- Very good control on opposing melee, between the Druid and the Hunter
Weaknesses
- Very slow games for the most part, the idea is to outlast, not burst, thus resulting in rather “boring” games for most
- Pets with no resilience and much less life than teammates can be killed fairly easy if not watched properly
- All ranged DPS, thus can be LOS’d fairly easy, especially on Nagrand.
Overall Summary
Such a lineup, although not very popular, still has been seen on top of several BG’s, especially in Season 3. The idea of having no Warrior or Rogue was unheard of, but it really does work out very nice for a Drain Team. Yes, you do not have the big burst ability or what not, so the game turns into you just CC’ing and Draining, but it will result in wins in the long run if ran correctly. You can substitute the Shaman for a Paladin, to provide a BoF, but bloodlust will help on the mana burns and mana drains early. This lineup can also be fun for healers, as they will see themselves assisting DPS more often than any other lineup.
I know that some of these lineups don’t have to be the exact classes, but from my experience and from doing some research, its what I found was the best for such lineups. And this article was not meant to hate on certain lineups, while encouraging others, but instead it should be seen more as just a guide for those who weren’t sure what to run, or who were just curious what all these titles exactly meant. Feel free to put any input in on any of the lineups to help out with Strengths and Weaknesses, and I hope you guys enjoy.
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March 1st, 2008 at 8:22 pm
It’s “FelGUARD” not “FelGAURD”
March 2nd, 2008 at 2:46 am
how did the name 2345 come about?
March 2nd, 2008 at 3:11 am
heh, sorry about the mispell…. good to see you caught that though, means you actually read it ;).
And I am pretty sure 2345 came about just because it was easy to say, and it was the most common and successful lineup in 5v5 arena for a while. I cannot give you an exact reason though.
March 2nd, 2008 at 3:19 am
wasnt it called 2345 because that was all the buttons the elemental shaman needed to press for a win?
March 2nd, 2008 at 4:17 am
then where did 2346 come from? heh… tbh, im sure there are several rumors out there, and we really wont know the “true” meaning, but meh, not a big deal.
March 2nd, 2008 at 5:54 am
2345 has a made 2346 doesnt 6>5 cos lock>mage, 2345 came about from shaman buttons for the win following heroism
March 2nd, 2008 at 9:51 am
The term 2345 was coined by Noktyn and Sck from Power Trip (now Pandemic) when describing The Fighting Mongooses’ (For Great Justice) setup during the online regionals of season 1. The term was meant as a dig to describe the ease of gibbing players with that setup (Heroism/Bloodlust + massive burst) with that setup. ie. mashing 234523452345…
There are other setups like 4dps with more burst, but the name stuck and 2345 has proven to be one of the best all around 5v5 setups. Another bit of trivia: TFM originally ran 2x elemental shaman at the start of season 1, but later subbed in a mage for the extra shaman.
And correct, 2346 is just lock > mage.
March 2nd, 2008 at 2:30 pm
6 being lifetap haha
March 2nd, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Will the drain team still do well now that resilience affects Mana drains?
March 3rd, 2008 at 7:35 am
2345 came from the sequence of buttons a shaman had to press for their big burst.
2346 just denotes the team uses a warlock instead of a mage.
March 3rd, 2008 at 3:19 pm
I find it rather funny that you mention the 4-DPS being the easiest when you proceed with: “Come Season 3 however, more and more teams realized how to counter 4 DPS teams and how to play a lot more defensive early on, making it much more harder for most 4 DPS teams to be successful.” If a lot of people know how to counter your setup it isn’t that easy is it
?
Standing up for my Eleshaman, mage, warlock, paladin, spriest setup here ^^
Furthermore, just that you can instant gib a person doesn’t mean it’s easy… Maybe that sounds a little random, but 3 clothies (one being spriest) and only 1 healer to cover up your teams mistakes just make no room for error or RNG.
But ye sure, spamming viper sting/drainlife, waiting for the other team to go oom, waiting for a lucky WF then instant gibbing (if not instant gibbed by random 2warr 3 healer scrub team) or just have a bubble/Nature swiftness/PS to back you up and worthwhile healing is surely a lot more skillful.
My point being - don’t simply judge a team on the ability that they can instant gib - most ppl can under the right circumstances instant gib anyway -.-
I will take my setup where i live on the edge, making gamebreaking sheeps/CS’, having adrenaline pumping and knowing that everything comes down to a quick gib or quickswitch to be even remotely succesful - over a cookie cutter 2,3,4,5 setup with no innovation anyday
March 3rd, 2008 at 5:02 pm
the drain team will dominate next patch with the introduction of MS flame tongue totem, just imagine how fast opposing healers will go oom trying to keep up multiple targets with MS and DoTs.
March 3rd, 2008 at 5:09 pm
Currently i run a new team that was just made not long ago and has progressed to a much higher bracket (averaging 100 points a night). We run a Mage, Rogue, BM hunter, Pally, Priest. Would you have any suggestions on good strats against 2345, 2346 setups… We haven’t had much problems with them but we are almost only facing those setups and want to have a solid strat. Currently we are killing locks pet (normaly twise cause of resummon) and going for the lock, or just burning the mage.
March 3rd, 2008 at 6:50 pm
@11
Again, I did not make this article to post my personal views on teams, and I am sorry if you came across it as if I was putting your makeup down. I have respect for great 4 dps teams, I really do…. to be the top of any BG, you have to be skilled, no matter what makeup you play.
But rather my point being was that it is considered the easiest to play by most because there is the less strategy involved that most other teams may have to use. I have played 4dps myself, although it wasn’t with the best of players nor was I able to get it passed a 2100 rating, I do have the personal experience of being a part of the team and if I was to give a personal opinion on the lineup, I did find it the easiest as far as having to think about what is going on. As far as the drain team being just as easy, I really have not played against enough or played on it myself to make that judgement.
But I really want to reiterate that I did not make this article with the intention of putting down any of the lineups, and I hope I cleared things up.
March 3rd, 2008 at 9:54 pm
@7
What ever happened to The Fighting Mongooses?
March 4th, 2008 at 2:10 am
WB Breaky - or have you been lurking in the Shadows all along?
March 4th, 2008 at 7:37 am
The Fighting Mongooses lost in the first round during the regionals in San Deigo. It was seen as a huge upset as they were the highest rated team that was left intact after the Blizzard’s DQs.
Coming up to the tournament, a few of the members we already getting burned out on the game — all were officers/core members of a full time raiding guild… warrior Korgan was FGJ’s main tank — and they disbanded after S1. The priest SR/Soulrender went on to play on Napster’s Team Rupture for S2.
March 5th, 2008 at 6:13 am
#14 No harm done. I agree on you that this setup is very friendly to starters, but playing later on (or against full gladiator teams on 1700 rating. Curse this Wannabe BG9 Cylcone hype -.-) it really puts you to the test
Thanks for the clarification tho
March 5th, 2008 at 7:46 am
Great writeup, Breaky. It’s articles like these that keep me coming back to this site.
March 5th, 2008 at 4:08 pm
2345 is receiving a slight nerf in 2.4, ele shamans now have a shared cooldown between nature swiftness and elemental mastery, much of the instant burst is from the shaman.
March 7th, 2008 at 12:00 am
@20
I am pretty sure they reverted that change and it is now back to being seperate cooldowns.
March 26th, 2008 at 11:50 am
@ 11
I have played on 2345(2000+ rating), 2346(2100 rating), and a 4 DPS team (2200+ and counting). And from my experience, 4 DPS is by far the easiest as long as you have a good person calling out the main focus - at the right time. Like Breaky said, it requires the least amount of CC. All you need is one person out of place, and they’re basically dead. I do agree however, that it takes skill to play, but not as much as you would need on another team, such as the euro comp.
June 6th, 2008 at 4:57 pm
Keep up the good work. I am hooked on this site now!